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	<title>Comments on: Three</title>
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	<link>http://www.amymossoff.com/parenting/101/three/</link>
	<description>Finding meaning in my everyday experiences</description>
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		<title>By: ObjectivistDad</title>
		<link>http://www.amymossoff.com/parenting/101/three/comment-page-1/#comment-1057</link>
		<dc:creator>ObjectivistDad</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 24 Sep 2008 17:03:15 +0000</pubDate>
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		<description>I think Man O&#039;Steele&#039;s point -- the well-understood/actionable threat factor is an important part.

In addition, I think the 1-2-3 helps the kid *focus* on the action she must take next. Given the urgency of a countdown, adult would find himself more focused and driven to reaching the point where thoughts converts to action. I assume kids do too.

Another way of spurring action is to focus on the place where action begins. For instance,  I&#039;ve found there are times when &quot;Come for dinner&quot; does not work, but &quot;Put that down, and come for dinner&quot; works.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I think Man O&#8217;Steele&#8217;s point &#8212; the well-understood/actionable threat factor is an important part.</p>
<p>In addition, I think the 1-2-3 helps the kid *focus* on the action she must take next. Given the urgency of a countdown, adult would find himself more focused and driven to reaching the point where thoughts converts to action. I assume kids do too.</p>
<p>Another way of spurring action is to focus on the place where action begins. For instance,  I&#8217;ve found there are times when &#8220;Come for dinner&#8221; does not work, but &#8220;Put that down, and come for dinner&#8221; works.</p>
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		<title>By: Amy</title>
		<link>http://www.amymossoff.com/parenting/101/three/comment-page-1/#comment-1036</link>
		<dc:creator>Amy</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 16 Sep 2008 12:08:18 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.amymossoff.com/?p=101#comment-1036</guid>
		<description>Great comments!  Man o Steele, you are so perceptive about children!  &quot;The concretization of patience&quot; seems to be the essential answer to my question.

And rootie, that is hilarious. It seems obvious not to do the things you did, but I know that when you are in the situation you can get really confused and do silly things.  I&#039;ll watch out for that.  I think I may have slowed my pace a couple of times but I&#039;ll have a firm standing order in my mind from now on not to do that.  And, of course, as the child matures, techniques must be updated.  I know the counting won&#039;t work forever.  I like how you keep an active mind and are trying new things.

If kids came with an owner&#039;s manual it might be quite boring, don&#039;t you think?  :)</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Great comments!  Man o Steele, you are so perceptive about children!  &#8220;The concretization of patience&#8221; seems to be the essential answer to my question.</p>
<p>And rootie, that is hilarious. It seems obvious not to do the things you did, but I know that when you are in the situation you can get really confused and do silly things.  I&#8217;ll watch out for that.  I think I may have slowed my pace a couple of times but I&#8217;ll have a firm standing order in my mind from now on not to do that.  And, of course, as the child matures, techniques must be updated.  I know the counting won&#8217;t work forever.  I like how you keep an active mind and are trying new things.</p>
<p>If kids came with an owner&#8217;s manual it might be quite boring, don&#8217;t you think?  <img src='http://www.amymossoff.com/wp-includes/images/smilies/icon_smile.gif' alt=':)' class='wp-smiley' /> </p>
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		<title>By: rootie</title>
		<link>http://www.amymossoff.com/parenting/101/three/comment-page-1/#comment-1006</link>
		<dc:creator>rootie</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 12 Sep 2008 03:42:04 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.amymossoff.com/?p=101#comment-1006</guid>
		<description>Counting worked for a while for us, but I think when it didn&#039;t, the blame wasn&#039;t with counting, but our application of it.  

We started with using a 5 count instead of a 3 count.  We also weren&#039;t firm on the line we ended up changing the pace of the count to avoid giving the consequence, and doing 4 1/2, 4 3/4, etc.  I would recommend against both those things.  Yes, every kid is different, but 5 is too long for them to focus, and the flexible ending means the rule doesn&#039;t really have meaning.  (my interpretation, not a scientific thing).  My advice is to keep the rate even, and the consequences consistent and assured.   

Our 4 year old recently has been going through a period of experimenting with his control in several ways, some of which exploited our softness.  As a result, we&#039;ve actually reverted to immediate consequences, and dispensed with counting.  I&#039;m not sure where we&#039;ll go from here, but maybe we&#039;ll try a sit-down discussion and resume a firm 3 count.  If only kids came with an owner&#039;s manual...  

rootie</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Counting worked for a while for us, but I think when it didn&#8217;t, the blame wasn&#8217;t with counting, but our application of it.  </p>
<p>We started with using a 5 count instead of a 3 count.  We also weren&#8217;t firm on the line we ended up changing the pace of the count to avoid giving the consequence, and doing 4 1/2, 4 3/4, etc.  I would recommend against both those things.  Yes, every kid is different, but 5 is too long for them to focus, and the flexible ending means the rule doesn&#8217;t really have meaning.  (my interpretation, not a scientific thing).  My advice is to keep the rate even, and the consequences consistent and assured.   </p>
<p>Our 4 year old recently has been going through a period of experimenting with his control in several ways, some of which exploited our softness.  As a result, we&#8217;ve actually reverted to immediate consequences, and dispensed with counting.  I&#8217;m not sure where we&#8217;ll go from here, but maybe we&#8217;ll try a sit-down discussion and resume a firm 3 count.  If only kids came with an owner&#8217;s manual&#8230;  </p>
<p>rootie</p>
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		<title>By: Man o' Steele</title>
		<link>http://www.amymossoff.com/parenting/101/three/comment-page-1/#comment-1000</link>
		<dc:creator>Man o' Steele</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 11 Sep 2008 02:30:21 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.amymossoff.com/?p=101#comment-1000</guid>
		<description>I remember that when my mother counted to three, her tone would get more and more severe with each number.  Do you do that?

My guess, and this just based on my own childhood memories and my experiences with my students, is that counting to three clearly sets the limits of your patience.  Children know that they have a line of patience-credit with each command you give them.  When a child is opposed to the command and doesn&#039;t vividly understand why they should obey it, the natural course of action is to resist it until the patience wears out.  Counting to three gives them a vivid and concrete understanding of the limits of your patience.  On three, the force that will ultimately compel them to do obey is clear and present and they naturally obey.

I imagine it seems almost magical to parents because you understand the limits of your patience when you don&#039;t count to three just as well as when you don&#039;t count to three.  Nothing is changing for you accept the words you speak as though they were a magic incantation.  But for the child, it is the difference between knowing the limits and testing the limits. The child understands his limits when you count to three, he doesn&#039;t when you make some other threat.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I remember that when my mother counted to three, her tone would get more and more severe with each number.  Do you do that?</p>
<p>My guess, and this just based on my own childhood memories and my experiences with my students, is that counting to three clearly sets the limits of your patience.  Children know that they have a line of patience-credit with each command you give them.  When a child is opposed to the command and doesn&#8217;t vividly understand why they should obey it, the natural course of action is to resist it until the patience wears out.  Counting to three gives them a vivid and concrete understanding of the limits of your patience.  On three, the force that will ultimately compel them to do obey is clear and present and they naturally obey.</p>
<p>I imagine it seems almost magical to parents because you understand the limits of your patience when you don&#8217;t count to three just as well as when you don&#8217;t count to three.  Nothing is changing for you accept the words you speak as though they were a magic incantation.  But for the child, it is the difference between knowing the limits and testing the limits. The child understands his limits when you count to three, he doesn&#8217;t when you make some other threat.</p>
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